May 13, 2020

Detlef Schrempf — Seattle Supersonic Legend on Finding Success in VC & Wealth Management

Detlef Schrempf — Seattle Supersonic Legend on Finding Success in VC & Wealth Management

16-year NBA veteran, cult favorite, and former Seattle Supersonic Detlef Schrempf joins The Game Plan to discuss life after basketball and his role leading Business Development at Coldstream Wealth Management.

16-year NBA veteran, cult favorite, and former Seattle Supersonic Detlef Schrempf joins The Game Plan to discuss life after basketball and his role leading Business Development at Coldstream Wealth Management.

In this episode, we discuss how the game of basketball has evolved since Schrempf's time in the league in the 80s and 90s. We also take a look at how our guest built a support system of trusted advisors and was able to parlay his network and success as a professional athlete into a fulfilling career in wealth management.

Fans of "The Last Dance" Michael Jordan documentary will enjoy hearing what our guest has to say about facing Jordan's Bulls in the 1996 NBA Finals. Schrempf even describes what it was like being teammates with Gary Payton. We also discuss his appearances on NBA Jam, Parks & Rec, and as the namesake of an indie song.

You can follow Detlef Schrempf on Twitter and Instagram (@Dschrempf), and check out Coldstream Wealth Management at https://www.coldstream.com/.

Follow co-hosts Jay Kapoor (@JayKapoorNYC) and Tim Katt (@Tim_Katt) for all things sports, media, tech, and venture capital.

Follow The Game Plan on Twitter (@thegameplanshow) and Instagram (@gameplanshow) for show news and updates, to recommend guests, and for bonus content!


Transcript

*Please excuse any and all typos, errors and mistakes in the following transcript as an automated service is used to generate this text*

Oh yeah. Every day. We went at it every day. I mean, I love dairy. I talked to him all the time. He lives in Vegas, but we fought every day in practice. We curse each other out, but you know, once the game started, we all on the same page. But you know, we had a veteran team and, and we had hotheads but we always kind of got back to it.

We were playing together. So it was, it was fun. It was a crazy time, but it was a lot of fun. Hello, this is Detlef Schrempf, played in the NBA for 16 years, and now I'm a partner at Colster in wealth management. And this is the game plan.

So Tim, as investors, we aren't strangers to sending and receiving cold emails, but I have to say I'm pretty thrilled to have invited our next guest onto the show via a cold tweet just last week. Honestly, it's so hard to fit into one intro, all the amazing things that he's done since playing 16 seasons in the NBA.

So I'll just say that we are so pleased to have three time NBA all star now, director of business development for Coldstream wealth management, as well as my newest Twitter friend that left shrimp onto the game plan. Detlef thank you so much for joining us today.

Thanks for having me guys. Appreciate it.

Yeah. You played for so many years on some pretty memorable teams. I think some of our listeners will best remember you from the NBA jam era. As both an international player and someone who can knock down the three you were a bit before your time in some ways. Do you ever think about what it would be like to play in today's game?

Not really. I mean, I think I would love playing in today's game. , you know, it's, it's a little bit more wide open. it wasn't the drag out fight.  Bodying and elbowing and all that kind of stuff. It was more like, you know, Hey, use your talents, get up and down the court and create shots. yeah, I definitely would enjoy it.

but you know, I also enjoyed one applied.

Do you still stay pretty connected to the game? Do you enjoy watching playing coaching?

I watched games, you know, people they have, I think there, there are a lot of people that either say that will be in base or different, you know, it's not the same. And then other people are going, yeah. It's, you know, it's great, because it's so open, so many threes, and you never know what to expect.

And, you know, I enjoy the game, period. I don't care how you play it. times change, rules change. you know, math is brought into the game trying to figure out how we can be most successful, which back then obviously didn't happen. so the game always evolves and if it doesn't, it gets left behind.

So I enjoy the game. I enjoy the talent. You have incredibly talented players, now, physically, but also, you know, creative and what they do on the court and off the court. So I still watch it. I don't watch it as much as. I used to because when I get home, usually something else on the TV, so it's not like I'm going to change and say, Hey, let's watch the game.

My wife kind of argues to know, I said, at a thousand games, I'm not going to watch another one. You know? Fair enough. I'll watch it there. But, I love the game. I play it every day. If I could.

And so along that thousand game journey, at what point did you start thinking about life after basketball and what came next for you?

Probably, you know, I was just young and dumb and thought it would never end, but once I got into my thirties I thought, you know, how long am I going to play? And before you know it, I was 35 you know, and I go, Oh, that one quick. And then I figured, well, I'm feeling pretty good, but it could end. And , I was fortunate to live, you know, where we are in our community and now we have a very successful.

A market here. You know, my neighbors were executives. There were Microsoft people, they were tech people, there were startup guys. So, you know, you sit in the bleachers with your kids when they're little, if it's the boys and girls club or whatever, or you know, fifth grade basketball, and you kind of start thinking about, you know.

What else going on though? You have barbecues. So I had a, I had the pleasure of talking. A lot of guys have been successful and just brainstorming about what I should do after basketball. And that's how we kinda jumped into starting a private equity venture fund, while I was still playing my last year.

Who were some of the teammates or fellow players that you look to for guidance or advice when you were thinking about making that transition? I know there are quite a few athletes from your playing era that have now stepped into wealth management and private equity investing. Were there any athletes in particular that you look to as a potential model to follow in retirement?

No, there weren't really, you know, maybe there were somebody prior to me that, that made that transition. I'm sure there are people that, you know, moved on into business, and did something, but not in particular. And maybe what I was doing.  thinking back to Roger Staubach, way before me, but, I got to know him in Dallas and he was building an empire in Texas.

Right. for me it was more like, Oh, you know, I know I'm. Gonna retire. I can't sit at home and play Xbox every day with my kids. I'm not that, I can't sit still, so I gotta do something and, you know, so just brainstorming back and forth, and, you know, figure out what are my talents, you know, after basically being out of college for forever.

it doesn't really matter what you study. You'd have to start over. I'm sorry. Okay. What, what do I bring to a table? you know, where can I help and what am I good at? And, and how does that kind of translate into a possible job description or doing something and, you know, figured out a really good network.

I could open doors and I had access to a lot of people that have money. So that's how I partnered up with a group and kind of became the, you know, raising money and, and have an access to particular investments and , funds. And,  and so I didn't know anything about it and we just started it, you know, and I kind of learn on the spot, but, it, it worked.

It was, it was fun. it was a challenging and, you know, it kept me busy, kept me out of the house for half the day.

Certainly your profile as a former NBA player, it must've helped open doors and provide access to high net worth individuals, but the work you are doing now very much requires you to be a people person. Is that something that's always come naturally to you? It seems like it would be a big transition from playing the game of basketball.

Oh, totally. and I was not really a people person when I was playing. you know, I played in in a different era where, you were not friendly with. Other teams or other players on other teams? You know, there was always that kind of, I don't know, we hate it. Detroit. Oh, we hated the Laker, so whatever.

You didn't really. this was kind of the end of my career. We had summer trips, you know, but before that, there were no summer events. There were no Nike or Adidas events where the guy plays, the players did stuff together. So you didn't really interact that much with opponents. So it was, it was a, you know, you kind of guarded yourself and I was pretty guarded.

so it was definitely a challenge to open up and be really friendly and engaging and, and you know, and, and use what I had, but also then kind of talk about, Hey, this is what we want from you. How about, you know, giving us a million dollars and. Like, Oh, well you're, you know, you're an ass. You know? So, it was a, it was a challenge, but, you know, once I started doing it, I actually enjoyed, I enjoyed getting to know people and getting to know their background and what they were doing and how they, how they looked at things and approach things.

And so, it was a slow process. So, you know, I was fortunate enough, I ended up leverage. I didn't have to work. so I took my first year kind of just learning the ropes and, and, and went from there.

Yeah. You know, thinking back on the players of that era, I read a while back that you had a pretty interesting, and at times heated relationship with the glove. Of Gary Payton. What was it like playing with him and given his reputation for, let's say, being vocal? Was he often saying crazy things to you when you guys were playing together?

Oh yeah. Every day we went out it every day. I mean, I love dairy. I talk to him all the time. He lives in Vegas. But we fought every day in practice. We curse each other out. but, you know, once the game started, we all on the same page. but, you know, we had a veteran team and, and, and we had hotheads but we always kind of got back to it.

We were playing together. so it was, it was fun. It was a crazy time, but it was a lot of fun. So definitely. .

Yeah. And you served as an assistant coach for the Sonics for a couple of years. What got you interested in spending time on the coaching side, and I guess what made you decide to step away in the end?

Yes. I mean, I always enjoyed coaching. you know, I ran basketball camps for Adidas, and started my own camp in Germany and shoot, I want to say it was probably early nineties, and did that for over 10 years, and then ran ABC camps all over the world for, for Adidas. so I really liked that part of teaching.

so, that one was just an opportunity that kinda came up. , the Sonics that fired the head coach. And I was, I was around, I was working out with the guys in the summertime and stuff, and, you know, helping them kind of prepare for the season, you know, handful of guys and, this while we meet an assistant coach, are you interested?

And it kind of came at the right time, but our venture fund had, we, I kinda S. Stopped a couple of partners left and I wasn't going to, you know, do it myself from then on. So I said, well, why not give it a try? And, so that's how I got into coaching and, in for a year and a half.

Earlier you were talking about the formation of Athlon ventures, the private equity fund you founded in 1999 what really served as the catalyst for getting that off the ground.

Yeah. I think it came together by, you know. Brainstorming with my neighbors. And actually one of my neighbors seemed a dollar, became a partner in this. He just left Microsoft retired at age. Shoot, I want to say 36 from Microsoft. That's nice. Yeah. And he was like, well, I'll go in there with you for, you know, we'll give it a shot.

Give it a run. So, so we joined actually, I had, a guy in San Francisco that, that had a piece of my money and, him and his partner, I wanted to start this. So we, we joined up, came partners in the us and raised it. And, they actually managed also, some athletes money. So they had some clients that were interested in it.

And then I went out and got kind of other athletes and professionals to invest. for me, it was a learning experience, so I didn't really. You know, know much about doing due diligence on deals and, and, you know, following up on, , , how something progresses. for me it was more opening doors, having access to deals and bringing in new money.

So that part I basically learned on the job. which was fun. And it was an interesting, as you know, it's an interesting world because you can get really busy when there's a deal coming up and then there's nothing going on for a week or so or two, and you have a little followup. Here they are. So it seemed like a really enjoyable job that if you could scale it, what, you know, w would be pretty good.

yeah, so we actually, we got lucky. I did mostly real estate before that. I had a lot of real estate investments and Denver in the Colorado area. and so learning about private equity and Ben show is definitely a challenge. But, very interesting. You know, I, I couldn't tell you if it was a software startup, if that's gonna do well.

Right? So I sat in the meetings and doing the due diligence and I really enjoyed that part. most of the 99 2000 funds, where, as you know, probably 70% gut. Get killed. We did extremely well, and it was pure luck. We invested in a couple of home runs, you know, and, and, one of them was Pandora, you know, which was like 500 some X of what our investment was, you know, whereas 30 other companies went, you know, see you later.

So it is, it is what it is. , We,  we were going to raise another fund and then, a couple of partners, joined a billionaire to manage this, hospitality business. So they went, they went on their own and kind of go, nah, I'm not going out there by myself to raise the money again. And, you know, I didn't have the expertise to do that due diligence.

So we moved on from there.

So you made a considerable amount of money during your playing career. Maybe not that much compared to what today's max contracts look like, but I would assume that you've interfaced with wealth management groups before as a potential client. Was there anything from the personal experiences you've had on that side of the table that helped inform what you do now?

No, not really. , my money, it was kind of, before I retired, my money was pretty spread out on many different things. Yeah. I had some money with this firm in San Francisco, but it's, you know, basic before. I'm, most of my money was tied up in real estate deals and venture fund. , And when I got a little smarter, I realized that, I needed to do something different because, I had a business partner, my agent, and a business partner, and I was involved in a lot of things, that some of them turn out really well, but some of them have chance of not turning out well.

So, luckily I kind of figured it out and try to liquidate as much as I could at that point. and I didn't really start a relationship, with a wealth management firm. Until I joined cool stream because I figured if I start working for somebody, I better, you know, better, kinda be also invested there.

So I moved on money at that point. So it was a little over 12 years ago. Yeah.

More recently, you've been spending your time helping build out Coldstream wealth management. help us understand what that entails and where you feel like you bring a unique advantage to the team.

Well, basically, I'm out in the community and out and about and, you know, building out brands, creating a brand awareness that maybe 12 years ago it wasn't there. I mean, it was, but, you know, it's a very competitive world out there. And, You know, we're growing tremendously over the last 12 years.

And I spent most of my time, you know, reaching out to people and building relationships, trying to figure out where they are in life, where they want to go, what the family structure looks like, and how we could possibly help. And then if there's interest, I, you know, I, I kinda work with different teams on.

on the culture platform, different wealth management teams, we'll bring the one of the teams in and they would then take over day to day kind of operations. Whereas I stay more involved on the relationship social side.

So we often speak with our guests about retirement and what it's like to have the core components of team routine and competition taken away virtually overnight. Now, you've been away from the game for almost 19 years, and we've talked about your business endeavors, but we'd love to know what life's been like beyond basketball.

Well, that's a big question because there are a lot of parts to life after. To me, it's, you know, basketball is just part of life. it was a big piece of how you occupied your time and what made you tick and it, you know, what gave you that drive. But you know, there are so many other things too that, you know, family, kids,  things you're supposed to be doing in your community and all those things that are, you know, longterm, probably more important than the game you play.

I was fortunate enough to use basketball as kind of. leverage to do some other things, obviously the next work life. but also, you know, doing a foundation, for the same purpose of using my name and my stand position in the community. And I mean, I how big, how big the Sonics were in the nineties, to to build a really large platform in our community.

And, through that, again, you've built great relationships with sponsors and, and supporters, that you're in touch with for. Oftentimes decades, you know? So, it just, you know, basketball was a way for me to obviously succeed at something, but also it's, it's, it's just a venue to do other things. , and now, you know, you run into people that, you know, don't remember that I played basketball because it's a long time ago.

And you know, they talk about, well, you had a great foundation. Why did you do that and how did you get started? Or, well, your job, you've been there for a long time. How's that going and why? Why are you doing it versus talking about the NBA and basketball? So, yeah. Time moves on, you know.

Yeah. Yeah. I think you make a really interesting point there about identity and about decoupling your identity from the game of basketball. You know, we've seen that as one common theme among some of our guests that have found success and found a purpose after their sport. And on the other hand, there are still many former players that really struggle with finding that passion and that purpose.

In your experience, why do you think that is? Why do you think so many players have a tough time figuring out what they want to do after they're done playing

Well, it's a combination of, of things. While the first one to me is, she ever played in front of 25,000 people. And, You make the game winner or Mister game winner, you know, that emotional roller coaster that you can duplicate that in real life. , it's just, I don't care how many deals you do or, you know what else you do, your adrenaline, you can't do that.

So I think guys sometimes get in profit and trouble because it still chase that, you know, they still want that excitement. So I think when, when you stopped playing, you kind of got to scale everything down a little bit because it just, it doesn't happen, you know? Who plays in front of 20,000 people and they get booed or they get cheered.

It just, it doesn't happen. So, so you have to make an adjustment there. but also, I mean, most of us, you know, I went to college for four years, but after playing for 16 years, I was uneducated, you I couldn't go out and get a job because whatever I learned in college was absolutely. Yeah.

Basically. I mean, think about it. I studied international business that didn't study very well, but. Everything had changed. We didn't have computers, you know, I mean, so it's kind of like, okay, do I go back to school and or do I just jump in somewhere and try to figure it out? And for most guys, I think also the expectations go way up, right?

Because, well, I'm making four or five, $10 million a year. Now I retire, okay, I gotta do something, but somebody has got to pay me $500,000 a year. I go, what job is that? Right? Our entry level, if you start working for us with, no really education and you might be able to bring something to the table for so we can hire you as the see regulations, but at the same time, if somebody wanted to jump on board and be a business development person with me, you know you're going to get 50 grand.

And I'm thinking an NBA player is a pro athlete is going to take 50 grand. So you gotta keep your ego in check and you know, if you want to learn a new trade or do a new job, you gotta you've got to start somewhere where you're not accustomed to starting. Or you build out your own business and then you run into, okay, I'm going to spend a lot of my own money on doing something that might backfire.

So, it's, it's tough. I mean, most of us really were not that educated to start out with. And then you all of a sudden playful while we've made a lot of money, hopefully kept a lot, but then you own, okay, where's my next job? And that's a challenge.

Yeah. I know you said that you kind of had the comfort and time to figure out exactly what you wanted to do, but. Did you have some of those early missteps as you were trying to figure out what to do with your money? Did you find yourself being pulled to entrepreneurship or putting your money into something and then realizing later on that maybe it wasn't the best investment for you?

Oh yeah, everyone, you know, everyone always asked me to put a hundred thousand 200,000 here and there, and I did a few of those and I finally realized this, this is not the right play. I don't, I don't know if this is success. It's a friend or through a friend, but you know, I'm competing, not competing. I'm trying to co-invest with somebody that has a hundred million.

I don't have that, you know, so, I, if I lose $250,000, you know, he can, it's pocket change for him. For me, it was, you know, a pretty good amount of money. so I, I learned early on that I have to figure this out and I'll put a lot of money into Athlon ventures the first couple of years, and I realized, well.

I can't sustain that because I'm feeding the foundation at the time and I'm feeding this and , I appreciate trying to other people trying to help out and be part of it, but I can't keep paying them. So I had to make some adjustments and, and figure things out along the way. But I had, like I said, I had some time and resources to figure it out for a couple of years.

Earlier you mentioned that not everybody recognizes you as a former pro athlete, or at least is old enough to have seen you play in the NBA. That being said, your Wikipedia page is chock full of pop culture references. There's a song title using your name even appeared on a few episodes of parks and rec.

What's that been like for you? I mentioned NBA jam earlier as well. What's your perspective on all of that?

Yeah, huge star. I mean, you start, that's, you know, I get it now. You know, it used to be a go somewhere and, To a restaurant and the hostess, you know, young hostess would go, Oh, I know you. And she said, I, you know, I sat on my daddy's lap watching you play when I was growing up or something, you know? And I go, yeah, I make me feel old grade.

And I was like, Hey, you are in parks and rec. They don't even know I played basketball. Right. So it's, it's funny, but, yeah, did like three, you know, cameo appearances or so, but, you know, it was. 20 seconds here and there, and people remember they watch it. So it's funny, it's,

Yeah. I gotta say as a huge parks and rec fan, you know, you were part of some of the funniest episodes on that show and. I have to ask, I mean,  what's it like being on set with that cast and in that zany collaborative environment.

it was interesting because it's so different than what you're used to, right? Because you stand around all day. You stand around all day, set, you eat, you stand your weight, and then you do some for two minutes and then you wait another two hours. I would have a hard time living that life. It's just too much downtime.

It was cool because I did get to spend a little time, you know, because you have a lot of time with, some of the other, or the stars, not the other stars, the stars of the show. And we hung out. I, you know, I got to talk to her, she to Jones and everyone just kind of sitting around and talking. They were all very nice and it was pretty cool.

And, still talk to Ben Schwartz all the time. cause he fancies himself to be a basketball player. So it's always hilarious. so it was very interesting. but what a weird industry.

Yeah. I think a lot of people don't really understand the back of the house. Aspect of it, right? We all just see the finished product, but we don't really appreciate how much work goes into the back of the house. Right.

And the unions involved. It was like amazing. And we'd do a shoot and there'd be a cable there and there, Oh, we need to move that cable up and out or go over there and try to move the cable there. Stop, stop, don't touch, don't touch. And they go, what. Just move it over here. There are no, and somebody would run out the back and move that cable one foot, you know, that was, it was stuff like that, like, Oh, this, this is quite amazing.

You know, there are hundreds of people and you don't know what any of them were doing, but they're all there. So it's a, it's a big industry.

Alright. So it sounds like maybe you won't be diving deeper into show business anytime soon, but yeah, you have gotten more active on social media, which shows a few different interests. Like. Traveling, working out, maybe even the occasional cigar. tell us a little bit about everything else that keeps you busy.

Well, unfortunately, when you get older, you gotta do the check Mark. Right? So, like a time like this, when we all locked up, kinda, she can only go outside for a walk or run, I, which I was still running. and I'm, I don't, I can still run a little bit, but I don't run it at run anymore because. It's tough on the body, you know, and, and that my age, I want to, I don't want to have a knee replacement in the next five, 10 years.

I want to stretch that stuff out as long as possible. but those are the things where you kinda, you know, you wish you were still doing those things or play basketball. If I couldn't play basketball, I'd have a hoop somewhere and just, you know. Due to seventeens across and shoot hoops. I, but so that, you know, the check Mark and then you kinda go, okay, what's left?

What do you enjoy doing? So I love to play golf, because it's social, you get to spend, you know, four or five hours with someone, and, if you don't enjoy me, not going to play with them again. So to me, that's, that's a great way I'll use it for work too, because you really get to know people, how they interact with other people, with the service staff.

If there are people you want to work with. yeah, I do like to smoke a good cigar and I like to drink a good tequila. and we do that a lot in Cabo because we have a home there and we're just kinda, that's where we relax and hang out. It's a, it's a good place for us. Other than that, you know, we work, I get, you know, kids want to, one of them is the youngest is with us and the oldest one lives in Colorado.

So you're trying to stay with, you know, in touch with them and figure out whether you're going and what's going on. And, and we have a good circle of friends that we stay busy with. So. And the last thing I'm doing is I worked with the university of Washington, the scholarship athletes, actually all athletes on kind of trying to figure out, you know, what life will bring after sports and how to, how to address it and how to, how to go about, you know, building a network.

Now while you have a name, making some contacts in the alumni network, trying to figure out, okay, if I need an internship, where do I go? Things like that.

Well. Hopefully you can send them this episode of the game plan when it comes out and they'll be able to learn a thing or two from you.

Okay. Will do.

Hey, look, we really appreciate you hopping on with us on short notice, especially during these uncertain times. We'd like to ask you what amounts to our closing question that we ask all our guests because we know that the folks listening to the show, or not just entrepreneurs and business people, but also college and professional athletes thinking about their lives outside the game.

What is some wisdom or advice that you would have for them as they are thinking about writing their own game plan for that transition.

 Well, I wanna think. like I said, I was lucky to surround myself with a lot smarter people than me. And I think you only are as good as the people around you.  So when you, it's easy to carry people with you when you're, have a lot of success and there'll be a lot of people that want to be, you know, with you when you have a lot of success.

But when the, when the lights go off and they're all of sudden dark and you're not in the limelight anymore. the people around you kind of make who you are. So surround yourself with people that, that challenge you, that provides some opportunities for you, that provide some avenues for you where, and suggestions and say, you got to do this and you got to do it right.

and, you know, I, I suck at a lot of things, but I know that. the way I was successful as I'm, I'm on a grind it out and try to figure it out. And if I don't like it, then I step away. But it's people that give you that opportunity, that tell you, Hey, you should try this. You're good at this, try this. and I think that that will, that will have a positive impact on your life and not just you, but your family.

Well, I love that advice, especially because it's relevant not just for athletes, but also for entrepreneurs who we know are going to face so many challenges in these uncertain times. If you are dedicated to it and you focus on it and grind it out. Good things are gonna happen, and I love that advice. So Detlef, thank you so much for joining us on the game plan and for sharing that with us.

Thanks so much for having me guys. You guys be safe.

Take care too. Thanks so much. So Tim, that was a pretty insightful conversation with my new Twitter buddy Detlef shrimp, but I want to get your thoughts on it. What were some of your biggest takeaways.

Yeah. Well, first of all, I was really just blown away. By his level of humility, not just with us. You know, we had reached out to him on Twitter. That was, that was great that he's willing to come on the show, but, clearly he's at the point where he's at now and has had success off the court that he's had because he's been willing to, like he said, check your ego at the door.

I think the example he gave about. You know, what's a player willing to work for from like a salary standpoint? post-career, like there's just a lot of guys out there who wouldn't even consider something. . It'd be insulting to them if it wasn't a big contract, but that's just not necessarily how the world of business works, especially when you've got to prove the value.

You can add the dedication you have to something. So to me, that was the biggest thing I took away from his path. and I also think surrounding yourself with smart people, right? So for him, he was in the right place at the right time, being in Seattle, in the Pacific Northwest, as a lot of these tech companies were coming about.

And so. You know, the fact that he had neighbors that were at doing really well at Microsoft and other tech companies is certainly served him well. But you took advantage of that. He valued these people's opinions and he figured out a way to work with them. And again, that's another thing that I think led to his success.

Yeah. Coming back to your point on humility, you know, I was just, I remembered, when we asked him about that first fund that he had invested in, right. And he mentioned that a lot of their peers that had started investing around the same time, at the.com crash basically went out and they had a pretty successful investment in Pandora that, you know, basically returned well, well above return the fund.

And what I caught right away was he said, yeah, and we basically got there out of pure luck. And you know, it's like, Hey, that's, that's pretty nice of him to say. Obviously, you know, you want to think that because he was surrounded with smart people because he had a team that he really trusted and worked with, that they put some good money to work.

But we tend to see this with a lot of investors that tend to equate, you know, luck with skill. And I think he's sort of thinking about it the other way where he's saying, you know what? Whatever skill I had, I have to give deference to the fact that a lot of luck played into it. And we know we hear this from some athletes, right?

I think athletes understand that you could come in and play the best game that you have, and sometimes luck just doesn't go your way. Right. One adjustment here or there changes it up. and, and I think maybe his experience and coming from the era that he played in maybe plays into the humility that he brings to the investing that he's doing.

Yeah, and I think about in the investment world, since you bring up a good point, I know venture. Capitalists that were in the Bay area in the early 2010s with significant amount of capital to put to work, and they kind of missed on really the big wave of opportunity that, that came out during that time.

And it's not necessarily knock on them, but there's just a lot of luck involved. so better to be lucky than good. I guess.

Well. Yeah, definitely. And at least, you know, what he has realized is that there are things that he can control. He can't control the luck of how well an investment that he's made is going to do. And you know, he invested across quite a few asset classes, you know, real estate and private equity, venture capital, got to know a lot of people through that.

Right? Got to, got to leverage his access. And we've seen this as investors. The access that you have with some of the top deals can define whether or not your fund returns. And I think he's taken that in a different direction. We said. You know, I have the access and how can I really leverage that to bring folks to invest with us?

And so, you know, given, given that that's where his role is, he's figured out how to leverage that access in a good way. We talk to athletes about this a lot where they say, you know, you stop playing and then what do you have. Well, you have your brand, you have your name, you have the reputation that you've built and how you treat people and how you engage with people, how you engage with fans.

And if you maintain that really well when you're playing, then you have all these opportunities available to you when you come out. And deadlift. Played in an era where guys weren't always the nicest and you know, things were a little bit heated against other players or fans from other teams. but he still, you know, held himself in a.

In that sort of a stature that he could still go out and leverage that access after he stopped playing.

Yeah. I almost wanted to ask him, you know, don't you wish that the league had been a little bit more friendly so that you could have been prospecting, you know, future clients? He didn't, you know, he didn't know it at the time, but you start to see that a little bit nowadays with, athletes going in on deals together.

That's just not something that would have happened as part of his era.

Yeah. No, there's, I mean, obviously the game has changed a lot, but I think. The structure of how athletes are viewed and how athletes think about their own, you know, their capability to do things off the, off the court has also changed quite a bit since he started playing. So, yeah. I don't know if that crossed his mind when he was, you know, knocking elbows with, with Gary Payton and those guys.

But, that, that was kind of a fun story too, where, you know, he mentioned that. the era that they played in, not only was he joined with guys from other teams, but he was joined with guys with his own team. And it's just like, you know, that's just when you, when you come up in that to then transition into a very client facing very, you know, smile on your face, no matter how good of a day you're having sales role almost.

it's, it's nice to hear him talk about. How'd that transition wasn't the easiest, but he put his mind to it. He decided he was gonna grind it out, and that's the advice that he offers. You know, other athletes that are thinking about it as well.

Well, I think that's a great way to wrap up this week's partner meeting. Jay, appreciate your perspective.

  All right, and that's it for this week's episode of the game plan with Jacob Horn, Tim cot. As always, thanks so much for listening. We really enjoyed having Detlef shrimp on the show. Make sure to follow Detlef on social media where he's active across Twitter and Instagram.

We'd love to hear from you. Find us on Twitter at the game plan show, or leave us a five star review on iTunes. We'll see you next week on the game plan.